Evo likes llamas and alpacas 6 0

I'm tired of the good guys - bad guys bs I've been reading. As far as I'm concerned, I get fun by doing something I know will bring some frustration to the rival side. That makes what I do even more enjoyable. What a monster I am! My deeds do not need to be understood. Whether I played to conquer a country just to build roads for them and then give the regions back, or I did it just to bully them until I get convinced to leave them in peace, I'm just setting my goals in the game either to offer some fun or not to get bored.

We play the role we chose to play, discussing about who is good and who is bad is simply bs. With phylosophical approaches the conclusions are different. On one hand it's been said we are all bad by nature. On the other hand, we are all good but can get corrupted. What I conclude is that I better expect the best from people without forgetting how bad they can get/be so I don't get surprised when that happens.

If it is possible to judge something with different approaches and opinions, it's just quite a chance to learn and enjoy, any drama out of that is for some to get pop-corn and enjoy the show, and for others to get on stage and play one or the other's side belief the best possible way. I think trolling is a teenage behavior which is either responsibly or irresponsibly brought to adulthood in order to achieve pleasure to one's ego, and also any observed side benefit like mind setting players.

For sure I troll from time to time, it is fun and I don't have enough self-control not to do it. I even have problems with setting the limits for it and I think it's shameful. But I'm pretty sure I can manage to control what I do when there are children for instance, or peaceful people who are highly esteemed by me.

My advice is either to balance the cause - consequence relation with the chosen strategy not to get more players leaving, or to put egos aside and to properly address some written apologies not to get misunderstood/misinterpreted on not having hatred intended.

z78sabjan 94 Unread
05:18:04, 04/12/16 2
Alejandro Salek

I understand what you saying, BUT:

- You can't seriously think, that people leave the game because of trolling. Why? Well it's easy, because there was no trolling for two years, people left anyway
- You can't seriously think people leave because of warmongerism. Why? Well, the same reason, there was basically no wars for two years, and people left anyway...

Actually it's quite the opposite. When vnations had thousands of players before, there was ALWAYS wars, frustration, losses and wins, there was trolling and flaming, people were forced to cooperate and work together, to be able to defend or to attack, there was hatred and love, outburst and pain, glory and fame. All these things are going always hand in hand, none can exist without the other. You can tolerate trolling or not, like flaming or not, but PLEASE, leaving the game because of it? :)
Tell me one thing, who forced you to read Booms' articles? You see, if I read a paper what I don't like, then I won't buy it next time! Instead you guys complain about something, blaming it for the cause of people leaving the game, while the truth is, most of us left because of boredom.

And if you wanna know the truth about Xav, he is in and out only, because he is just a guy like you or me, and he got fed up about the widespread criticism what he got most of the time, whatever he tried to achieve. It's hard to stay unbiased, as a player, and a developer at the same time, when whatever you do gets you the negative comments of others. On the other hand, he has to play as well, otherwise it would be simply impossible to develop something what he doesn't experience as the players themselves do.

Take for instance the WM changes. Long long ago, we had pretty brutal wars. In fact one after another. I'm not saying that we had millions of players, but we had a decent few thousand pop. What happened? people cried and cried why they get deleted, and that's destroying their community, and there is no point to play like that etc etc. Xav changed the rules, made attacking much much harder, defending much much easier, basically not worthwhile to do any wars at all. The result? Just what I expected. Yeah you're right. There were no wars anymore. As you wished, you had "the chance" to advance and live the boring life of vnations. Slowly but surely people stopped talking in the chat, there were no articles anymore, because there was nothing to talk about, there were no cooperation between nations, not even individuals anymore, because there was no need of it, and slowly but surely people left the game.....

Tell me something. When was the last time you saw this many articles? When was the last time YOU wrote an article? When was the last time, you saw people get together on the chat and sit through a night just to make sure you won't get defeated in a battle?

It's time that you people recognize a sad or not sad but universal truth: in these type of games, YOU NEED conflicts! You need wars! You need losers! You need drama!
Why? Because in exchange on the other side YOU GET friends and cooperation. You 'll have winners. You'll have satisfaction.

IMHO if I lose, the solution IS NOT to leave the game, but to try to turn the table even if it takes a long time!
If I see someone trolling, and I can't take it, then the solution is not to blackmail the others that I'm gonna leave if they won't stop, but simply ignore it (after all you just have to NOT click that button to read it)
And if a war doesn't going in my favor, then the solution is definitely not to quit, give up, or cry for rules change to make it easier for me, but to do everything to turn the tide.

But hey, this is OK, now we're talking about something, now you are interested in something, now you guys have the motivation, to at least SAY something! So I could care less if our opinions meet or not, if I convince you or not!
I'm happy that this is happening, and I just hope it's not too late. I could write thousands of more things about this, and what led to the boredom and death of many players, but it's already too late for me, so catch u later!
Alejandro Salek 90 Unread
04:08:26, 04/12/16 1
z78sabjan I think Tactician might think as I do with the following fact: Developing nations might need to be those with the pop-corn for a while, specially when there are baby booms. For instance, 4 years ago most Bolivian players who played that well known FG and could have been lead here, stopped playing there, here and everywhere because of the situation we had there with trolling and war mongerism, which I don't disapprove. By then, because of different circumstances we did not have the chance to properly manage both a baby boom and a TO attempt against us, which also meant the end of Phoenix and Eden (FG alliances).

So, what the baby boomers perceived was that there were no chances for them in the game but to non-stoppingly become the victims of this trolling and war mongerism that was completely new to them.They did not stop playing without letting old players know the reasons they had for leaving the game. Wars might not last long but they last long enough to cause what we lived then.

You might think players in this kind of games are gamers used to this culture of trolling and war mongerism, but it isn't so with all the groups and I know myself as part of a bunch of examples of what I'm saying. Also, there is a time when frustration becomes a synonym of overwhelming boredom and the tendency is to quit in the pit (v-Pit). That, and they confessed it being so, was the reason we went from 60 players to 12 and then to 9, and finally the 6 that had the expecations of an experimented player. Or take Xav, for instance. Virtual Nations has the potential no other alike game has, but the lack of excitement has had him in and out lately.

People play a game because they have the chance of achieving something they get attracted to, something that is, in any way, somehow challenging as it is achievable. Take that away and they will no longer be active players unless they got committed to a comunity, which might mean a bunch of the players stay bound to the goals of a few in their particular community, or that the group might leave at the same time somewhen, meaning, whenever they find a new common interest. .

In the end, it is all about perception. You may perceive a nation as ready to face war in its own land, but then, the question is, do they perceive themselves so? For instance, I'm not familiar with whatever happened to Italy or Germany after the massive drop of players. For a moment they seemed to be recovering from that and the next I saw was that they somehow went through the same path Bolivia was walking.on.

You know we've done some trolling. Actually, that was one of the reasons you had made your mind from with the decision of attacking Bolivia. You also know we take our chances and that we decided to play for the weak, not because of a shared belief (which we share to a point) but because the alliances need to offer some balance to each side and the role of Robin Hood is needed there.

Why did we stay? Once a developing nation understands how the game works from what developed nations show and model, after a lot of pop corn, such a nation may not be fully developed but will perceive itself as culturally developed well enough to face and overcome any difficulty with the learned networking.
z78sabjan 94 Unread
19:06:34, 03/12/16 1
Everything what you said +1
Just one more thing to add: you forget the pshychological effects of trolling, which ultimately good for the game, because one way or another it does raise attention, or with your words, it gives a reason for some "popcorn time" ;)

As Booms said once, wars can be won by pen alone, everyone uses it to their advantage. For example not once we abandoned campaigns, because the losing side trolled for so long we just got tired of it :) As players leaving the game because of it, I don't think so. I had very heated arguments, -I wouldn't even call it trolling coz it was serious- with Duststorm a long long time ago, and I hated him for what he said many times, but just because a player or two says things I don't like, I'd have never considered leaving the game.
(Last Edited 19:11:16, 03/12/16)

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